Empowering and healing by connecting with nature - Leigh Clapperton
Leigh Clapperton, co-owner of the Pentland View Outdoor Sauna, talks with host Osbert Lancaster at the site of her business – a field on the edge of the Pentlands at Holland.
Listen to hear about Leigh’s career shift from social work to setting up a nature-based business, and the perhaps surprising connections between social work and her new venture.
Leigh talks about:
- how time in nature is good for people’s health wellbeing
- how more social prescribing would help more people but the system makes it difficult
- why we need to stop seeing people as victims and focus instead on empowerment
- and much more…
Changing Climate, Changing Midlothian explores what the climate and nature emergency means with people living and working in the county. Their reflections will help inform discussions as cross sector representatives and community leaders meet in October to agree a new Single Midlothian Plan setting collective outcomes and actions for the next three years.
Changing Climate, Changing Midlothian is produced for the Midlothian Community Planning Climate Emergency Group by Thrivable Scotland, and is kindly supported by Midlothian Climate Action Hub, Midlothian Community Planning and Midlothian Energy Ltd.
Find out more about:
- Pentland View Outdoor Sauna
- This podcast and the Midlothian Community Planning Partnership
- Thrivable Scotland
Thrivable Scotland helps changemakers engage their colleagues, communities and stakeholders to solve challenges today while building capacity to thrive in an unpredictable future.
Transcript
I was in the sauna the other week and there was teachers, social workers,
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:psychiatrists, and it was like all the
people that medicalize things and almost
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:write prescriptions and are part of
those processes, but they're choosing
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:to come here in nature to switch off.
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:I'm Osbert Lancaster, and this is
Changing Climate, Changing Midlothian,
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:where we explore what the climate and
nature emergency means with people
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:living and working in the county.
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:In this episode, I'm talking
with Lee Clapperton, owner of
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:the Pentland View Outdoor Sauna.
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:I met Lee for a walk at the
site of her sauna on the edge
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:of the Pentlands, at Hillend.
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:I started by asking Lee how she
came to set up the sauna business.
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:Leigh: I run this sauna
with myself and my sister.
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:Both come from very different backgrounds.
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:I was previously social work.
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:Um, she is catering her background.
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:We love the cold out wa outdoor swimming
being in nature and just, we almost, this
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:sounds a bit airy fairy, but I feel the
universe guided us to being able to open.
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:We met the right people, the farmer
who owns Swanston Farm, and an
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:opportunity came up and we just felt
Edinburgh needed an outdoor environment,
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:sauna, cold water experience.
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:I think for us it was about building our
community as well, of like-minded people.
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:However, we also wanted to
reach out to different groups.
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:So we're still in the
sort of process of that.
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:We've not quite been open a year.
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:So we, we also offer like discounted
saunas for like carers groups, um, mid
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:living mindsets, swimmer groups, uhhuh.
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:And the focus is very much on your
wellbeing, um, connecting with nature,
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:having a pause out of your busy life.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: You know what I mean?
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:So, yeah.
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:And, and it's, yeah.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:It's an amazing location as well.
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:Looking one hand looking, looking up
towards Hillend and the bits of the
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:ski slope and then across to Yeah.
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:Leigh: Yeah.
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:Osbert: Across the Lammermuirs and stuff.
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:I know, it's absolutely.
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:And, you know, yeah.
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:Absolutely amazing location.
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:Leigh: And our idea was just to
create an experience as well,
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:not just sitting in the sauna and
then sitting in a cold plunge.
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:We very much wanted to feel like we
could look after people for an hour.
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:We could switch off from
technology and all their stresses.
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:Create something accessible for people
with all different types of mobility
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:as well, we're not kinda a big walk
through a woodland or down by a loch.
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:It's like you can park and come up to
the site and you feel quite immersed
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:in the Pentland Hills immediately.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: And yeah, I think we didn't
really have any expectations and
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:we both still had our other jobs.
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:Mine as a social worker, um, my sister
is in, well she was in school catering.
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:And very quickly people came and
I think it was just the expression
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:on their faces and how elated they
were by the end of their experience,
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:people were immediately sort of
like, when can we get a membership?
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:Could I bring my kids?
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:Could I bring, my husband would
love this so I think it crosses
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:across all ages and genders,
which is really important as well.
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:Mm-hmm.
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:We have a, a campfire after and we
offer like herbal tea and homemade
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:cake, and people sit and chat after
and mm-hmm, it's a real sort of a
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:release from the stresses of life.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: And I think the consensus
and the discussion that comes up in
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:the sauna and with us and the guests
is, it's like the Pentland Hills
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:and nature can hold that stress.
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:Osbert: Mm-hmm.
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:Leigh: Like, I think people really
feel that like nature and being
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:outside is an, an unconditional
space to release all of that.
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:. A lot of people see how they socialise
always involves alcohol and food.
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:So when they come here they're like,
this is actually really nice, you know?
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: We're doing
something that that's fun.
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:Giving us a buzz like they maybe felt
they would get from a glass of wine.
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:However, they're feeling great
after their mental health's good.
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:They sleep well.
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:The feedback's brilliant.
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:Yeah.
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:You know, and they're quite often people
sit around the fire after and they're
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:like, we're booking our next session.
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:We're hopefully gonna open maybe a
second sauna on the same site here.
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:And yeah, we'll just see where it goes.
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:We don't really have expectations.
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:Mm-hmm.
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:We just, I think our main thing is
building relationships with people.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:And I guess, I mean, so thinking about,
you know, the last week or whatever
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:we've had all the stuff on the news
and the fires in Spain and France and
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:Leigh: Oh good.
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:Up north.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Yeah.
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:In the Cairngorms now it's like air
quality warnings for, for the Highlands.
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:I, I know.
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:In all of that sort of that big stuff
going on, how does, how does what you're
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:doing here fit into that, do you think?
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:Leigh: I think for us, we're just
really humbled by Mother Nature and in
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:a really basic sort of spiritual level
we really can almost like worship the
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:fire in the sauna and what it offers us.
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:I think we're all kinda up in arms about
fires and there's a little bit of us,
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:it's like, well what do they expect?
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:So, so yeah, we work with a farmer, we do
discuss things like if the gorse goes up,
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:'cause there was a fire on Swanston Farm
six weeks ago, over at the Dreghorn side.
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:So yeah, we just, and really
careful actually, 'cause we
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:have an outdoor fire and indoor.
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:So, yeah, just again, really humbled
and have to be cautious around it.
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:I was in the sauna the other week and
there was teachers, social workers,
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:psychiatrists, and it was like all the
people that medicalize things and almost
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:write prescriptions and are part of
those processes, but they're choosing
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:to come here in nature to switch off.
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:And quite often we'll have people sharing
that they're off their work with stress.
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:What stands out for us is I think
there needs to be more support and
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:initiatives, I suppose from the
government to, when I worked in social
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:work, it was the same, you know, you
had , supervision, but it, it was very
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:much just like sort of case management.
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:It wasn't actually what
can we do to support you?
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:And lots of people say, God, if we
could get financial support to do
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:something like this for our wellbeing
or could we have a team afternoon
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:and use your sauna and hire it?
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:I think that's the sort of thing we
need to be promoting because people
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:physically and emotionally leave
after one hour visibly changed.
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:Osbert: That makes a lot of sense.
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:There's a lot of, a lot of evidence
we need to be getting people out
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:into different kinds of spaces,
different kind of mindsets that
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:can spark really different ways
of, of thinking and doing stuff.
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:Leigh: Absolutely.
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:And I think it's, I think people
have to experience it too.
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:Osbert: And I'm just wondering,
how fanciful is this?
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:But maybe you frame it as in a away day or
a strategy session or something, but how
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:about a group of people in the community
partnership who are working on these
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:things, why not come here, come, come.
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:That's all like this.
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:I know.
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:I know.
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:Is is that, is that crazy?
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:Leigh: I know it isn't and I love it
and, it's breaking down those barriers,
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:which are all part of that, aren't they?
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:And I think we are very much about
the sort of nuances, like when
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:people lie on the grass, we're
like, did you hear the birds?
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:But I think that's where
then they begin to thrive.
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:And then these really amazing
conversations come up.
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:So,
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:Osbert: yeah.
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:And that's where that, I guess I'm
sort of thinking about this from
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:a sort of climate change, nature
emergency strategy policy bit.
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:Leigh: Yeah,
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:Osbert: absolutely.
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:Which is a bit, sounds a
bit divorced from this.
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:Think actually, like
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:Leigh: you're,
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:Osbert: if we need to be thinking
about doing things differently,
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:are we gonna come up with new
and different ideas sitting in a
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:meeting room or sitting on Zoom.
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:Leigh: Absolutely.
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:And I think unfortunately it
will come down to a select few
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:experiencing it and deciding
whether they like it or not though.
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:Mm-hmm.
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:'cause that's what will
probably affect the policies and
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: You know, 'cause at the
end of the day, everyone's meant
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:to be impartial, but they're not.
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:We all bring our history
with us, don't we?
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:Yeah.
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:And what we like and what our preferences
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:And the status quo , is partial as well.
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:Leigh: Absolutely.
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:Now we're a bit more established up
here, we're trying to focus on things
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:like recycling and, our own sort of
impact the products we use and sort
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:of just homing in on, on some of that
and our community, ' just encouraging
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:them to, like, we use recyclable
non-plastic lead cups and things so
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:people in the winter can take their Yeah.
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:herbal tea away with them.
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:However, like actually, please bring
your own, you know, and, you know, we'd
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:like to reduce that part off our waste
and, you know, we have a compost toilet.
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:And all of that has been such a
learning curve actually for us.
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:You know, because , okay, we can
have a compost toilet, but how do we
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:actually now get rid of that waste?
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:'cause there's actually not that
many commercial recycling facilities
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:in Edinburgh or Midlothian.
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:' Osbert (2): Given, what we are seeing
in terms of climate change, nature
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:crisis what would you be looking
to see public bodies in Midlothian
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:doing differently or starting to do
that they're not doing at the moment?
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:Leigh: Yeah.
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:Do you feel like you, do you
more mean for the individual or
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:for the environment, or both?
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:Osbert: For both.
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:For me it's about how do we thrive?
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:Yeah.
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:How do we thrive as, people Yeah.
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:Individually, and how do we thrive
collectively, together in groups
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:and how can nature thrive as well?
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:Leigh: Yeah.
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:Osbert: Because we, we
can't thrive without nature.
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:Leigh: Definitely.
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:I think for us, like with the starting
point is getting people to these
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:environments and bringing that awareness.
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:'cause I think for us, we didn't realise
some of the challenges and like how
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:things, can go wrong or struggle until
you're working in it and living in it.
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:And we're so detached from that
now in our houses and things.
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:So I know, I think a biggie for me
and I, I, I really, wished we had
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:more of it when I worked in social
work as well with social prescribing.
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:And I just think we talk about
it a lot, but it doesn't happen.
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:And to be honest, and I
kinda switched off from that.
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:I'm like, well, I, I'm not gonna
be able to change anyone's mind.
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:Osbert: Mm-hmm.
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:Leigh: Do you know what I mean?
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:But what we can do is do this
bit here, you know, in a field.
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:But definitely I think social
prescribing would be brilliant.
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:And I think just 'cause I think the
environment for me, like in the crisis, I
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:think that almost adds stress to people.
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:People are like, well, what can I do?
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:I dunno what to do.
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:Yeah.
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:Like, before we had this business, I was
a bit like, okay, I put my recycling out.
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:I do my garden bin.
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:And for, you know, and I would
periodically YouTube how to build like
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:a, natural compost waste in my garden.
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:And then we actually kept chickens for
a while, but then we got complaints
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:from all the neighbours for the mice.
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:And so it just felt like, you were
banging your head off a, a brick wall.
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:Because there's not a
positive sort of slant on it.
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:Everything's negative and, you
know, so I think it's changing,
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:the dialogue and how it's framed
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:Osbert: Given your experience
of social work if the community
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:partners the public sector, , the
third sector and the private sector,
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:we're gonna going to collaborate more
effectively around those social work
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:issues, that connection with social
prescribing, what might be different
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:about how they went about working
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:? Leigh: I think it really, to be
honest, has to come from a lot of the
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:management teams though, and the sort
of probably the hierarchy in these
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:organisations, because I think most
of the kind of frontline workers feel
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:probably a bit helpless and voiceless.
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:And they're dealing with
human crisis all the time.
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:But there was some amazing work going
on, you're just making me think about
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:even, but a lot of it was done by the
church, just really basic things like
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:gardening, like free opportunities
that, 'cause I think also people,
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:people don't wanna be named in shamed.
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:No.
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:Do you know what I mean?
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:And people don't wanna be victims.
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:Yeah.
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:So a lot of our kind of our helping
programmes are very much like,
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:you're broken come in, you do this,
you do that, and it's medicalized.
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:Whereas I think we need to empower
people a bit more to, and that's what's
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:nice about this sort of environment.
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:Often we'll get recovery groups come
in and straight away they're like,
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:that I'm gonna be addicted to this.
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:And I, and I know, and
I'm like, that's great.
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:You can be addicted to if
it's really healthy, good
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:Osbert: thing to be addicted,
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:Leigh: fill your boots.
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:Yeah.
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:Do you know what I mean?
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:Yeah.
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:I think it's got to be reframed, and
the narrative changed because Yeah.
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:People don't wanna be victims do they?
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:I think a lot of these organisations
are operating on a crisis level,
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:resources were always really
stretched, there wasn't enough carers,
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:there wasn't enough this or that.
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:And and then the service
isn't the quality it should be.
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:Osbert: Mm-hmm.
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:Leigh: There would be lots of, groups,
to get sort of frontline workers
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:feedback, but morale wasn't great and
people were burnt out, no one would
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:wanna take part in those groups to
share their views because it would end
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:up an offloading session of negativity.
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:Do you know what I mean?
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:Yeah.
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:Not creative ideas.
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:And just feeling, 'cause you've
not been heard for years.
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:You know, workers that are so tired,
so burnt out giving their all, you
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:know, and they've got their own
families, that's the thing too.
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:We all have our own life, eh?
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:Yeah.
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:And like, you know, people talk
about a good work life balance,
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:but we don't really have one.
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:Osbert: Yeah.
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:Leigh: Well I do now.
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:Osbert: You do, now you've sorted it.
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:Leigh: Well we work really long
hours here, but it's lovely.
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:And there you have it.
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:You've been listening to Lee Clapperton,
co-owner of the Pentland View Outdoor
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:Sauna on Changing Climate, changing
Midlothian with me, Osbert Lancaster.
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:I hope you found the conversation
as fascinating as I did.
